> ) writes:

>   Riddick is the best out there period. Lewis is a British Fag that
> has no chin via Bruno. lewis was beaten by Bruno, the ref shouldnt
> have stopped the fight, Bruno was stunned but not hurt. BOWES BACK
> AND HES READY TO DO IT AGAIN.

>I don't mean to (ugh!) defend Bert Cooper, but I do think that he has
>provided some good fights for decent fighters (ala Bruno) -- see vs.
>Mercer, Moorer, Holyfield. He has, of course, put in some awfully dreadful
>performances -- see vs. Foreman, Bowe, anyone recently. But, while I would
>pick McCall to beat him at this point, I think Cooper's had a much more
>distinguished career. He always (used to) come to fight, even when he lost.
>Now...I believe "pathetic" may be too kind.

>No, I don't rate anyone in a historical context--that's not a very smart
>way to rank fighters.

>Let's see...a fighter who's rated #1 by all 3 organizations who doesn't
>deserve it?  Howabout McCall...And I told you to check the magazine's #1

>Lee, at the risk of this sounding like a rule made up exclusively for Bowe
>(it's not), my ratings do in fact have a heart. If a fighter has a fight
>signed, then I won't put him on my "watch list" of inactive fighters. Bowe
>had a fight signed in February, in June and in July. (People on this group
>have suggested that he hasn't really been injured, but you can't convince
>me that he was afraid to fight Frans Botha or Buster Mathis). Now he's got
>a fight signed w/Lewis. It certainly does hurt him that he hasn't fought,
>and if Holyfield was still around(?), I'd rate him above Bowe, but the
>division is so devoid of quality fighters, that it's hard to justify rating
>Bowe any lower than he is.

>Now as far as Bruno, I agree: he can't win the big one. But I disagree that
>winning isn't everything. Hell, if that's the case, then we all should have

>Phrank Da Slugger

> Ahhh, but you said Lewis would finally fight one of the 4 best fighters
> in the world when he steps in the ring with Bowe.  Wrong.  He'll do it
> agains`t McCall first.  He may have done it against Tucker already.

> >rankings. I was pointing out #1 because NO ONE who knows shit about this
> >sport thinks that Oliver McCall 1) is the 2nd best fighter in this division

> Point #1 is irrelevent.  You're rating McCall in a historical context again.
> Like I said before, Bowe could lose against Lewis and lose a rubber match
> with Holyfield and I'd still bet on him to beat McCall.  But that doesn't
> mean he should be rated higher than McCall, right?

> Well, I don't see how Bowe can demand a title shot considering that his last
> fight was a loss.

>> Ahhh, but you said Lewis would finally fight one of the 4 best fighters
>> in the world when he steps in the ring with Bowe.  Wrong.  He'll do it
>> agains`t McCall first.  He may have done it against Tucker already.

>COME ON!! You can't seriously think that McCall's 1 of the 4 best fighters
>in this division! And Tucker?!?!?! When he beat Douglas and lost to Tyson

>> >rankings. I was pointing out #1 because NO ONE who knows shit about this
>> >sport thinks that Oliver McCall 1) is the 2nd best fighter in this division

>> Point #1 is irrelevent.  You're rating McCall in a historical context again.
>> Like I said before, Bowe could lose against Lewis and lose a rubber match
>> with Holyfield and I'd still bet on him to beat McCall.  But that doesn't
>> mean he should be rated higher than McCall, right?

>Of course not...UNLESS Bowe was knocked cold in 1 round to both Lewis and

>> Well, I don't see how Bowe can demand a title shot considering that his last
>> fight was a loss.

>You yourself said that you thought Bowe won that bout. Are you saying it's
>OK to play boxing politics and if a fighter is screwed out of a decision,
>then screw him? Just because Whitaker "drew" w/ Chavez, does that mean he
>only fought even w/ JCC? What mode of logic do you you use when viewing the
>sport? Do you just take every result and not apply practical analysis to
>it?

>Phrank Da Slugger

>>> Michael Moorer had never faced the quality of opposition Tucker
>>> had faced, until Moorer met Evander Holyfield.  Tucker's resume

>>> Lewis's next defense is a mandatory one against the #1 contender
>>> in all three major boxing organizations, Oliver McCall.  Like
>>> Moorer, McCall got his #1 rating by maintaining a winning streak
>>> rather than beating the cream of the heavyweights.  Its not a
>>> great fight but rather Lewis just doing his job.  Remember that
>>> when Bowe was asked to "do his job" and defend against Lewis,
>>> Bowe backed out.

>>> Now Lewis gives Bowe a non-mandatory shot at the WBC crown
>>> just to prove who's better.  And it seems like he's even giving
>>> Bowe the 60-40% split that Bowe had refused him.  That's a
>>> gutsy move.  If every champion had attitudes like Lewis's, we'd
>>> have a hell of a lot more unified divisions.

>> Lee

>>Lee, you've done 2 things that illustrate just how desolate the Heavyweight
>>division is: defend both Tony Tucker and the ratings system of the alphabet
>>boys. And another thing, you seem, in your last paragraph, to think that
>>boxing is something other than a BUSINESS. In a perfect world, Bowe would
>>have fought Lewis 2 years ago, but the $$$ (Newman didn't think) was right
>>at the time. It is now, so they will fight.
>We all know boxing is a business.  But does that mean we can't praise the
>fighters who fight for something more than just money?  If Lewis just
>wanted to hang on to his title and make money, he could replace the Bowe
>fight with 2 or 3 smaller fights against guys who have practically no
>chance of beating him.  Look at what Bowe did when he was champion:
>he fought 2 guys who had no chance against him and Evander Holyfield,
>who he had already decisively beaten.

>>As for your comments on some of the Heavyweight losers, Tucker was
>>undefeated after Tyson because he spent a few years in drug rehab and when
>>he did fight, he fought nobodies for the most part. And if you can name one
>Your nobody is ruling the cruiserweights, according to you.
>>QUALITY fighter McCall has faced, I'll be surprised. His claim to fame is
>>dropping Tyson in a sparring session in '89 before Tyson's bout w/Tony
>>Tubbs.
>I believe McCall was the first person to beat Bruce Seldon when Seldon
>was still a hot prospect.  Of course, Seldon didn't turn out to be
>a top notch fighter but at least McCall was taking a risk at the time
>by taking on an undefeated up-and-commer.  You can't say the same
>for Moorer, can you?

>>And I think that you are somewhat knowledgable about boxing, so I can't
>>believe that you cite the fact that McCall is top rated in all 3
>>organizations as if that really means anything. If Lewis and Moorer are the
>Uh, gee - if you're rated #1 by all three organizations, doesn't that mean
>you're supposed to get a title shot?
>>titlists, then how can anyone say that Bowe (or possibly Herbie Hide) isn't
>>the real #1 contender?
>What do you mean by REAL number one contender?  If rating systems were
>just based on who we think/know are the best, we'd have the same two
>fighters whacking away at each other in a 10 fight series.  Sure, everyone
>knows Riddick Bowe is a better fighter than Oliver McCall.  So how many
>title fights does Bowe have to lose before he should get stripped of
>his #1 ranking, in your rating system?  Bowe could lose 5 times in a row
>to Lewis and we'd all still be pretty sure that Riddick is a better
>fighter than McCall.  So I guess you'd still rank Bowe as #1 and
>call for a Lewis-Bowe VI?  How can anyone say Bowe isn't the real
>#1 contender?  Well, he lost his last fight.  That should drop you
>out of the number one position now shouldn't it?

>>And Moorer didn't exactly face the best Heavyweight opposition, but the
>>Bert Cooper he faced in '92 was still a viable contender and much better
>>than anyone Tucker had recently beaten.
>Tucker had recently beaten Orlin Norris who was a much better cruiserweight
>and Heavyweight than Cooper ever was.  In fact, don't you rate Orlin Norris
>as the #1 cruiserweight now?
>[Ole! Ole!]
>Thank you!  Thank you!  :-)

>>Bowe in 8.
>>Phrank Da Slugger
>Lee